The Plunge Blog

In most areas of life, my talents are modest. I'm not a particularly great athlete, chess player, or flutist. I can't whistle.

One thing that at The Plunge that we're quite excellent at, however, is pissing people off.

Latest example? In our piece The 10 Dumbest Reasons to Get Married, we wrote the following:

"Dumb Reason #5. She's hot. This doesn't mean you need to marry ugly. It means that physical attraction is a necessary, but not sufficient, criteria for marriage. You need to really, really, really need to know this girl before you pledge the rest of your life. Sex appeal isn't forever. With apologies to Helen Mirren, no one's hot at 60."

A reader writes:

"My soon-to-be fiance and her family got the idea to use her late grandmother's wedding diamonds for her engagement ring and wedding bands.

"This adds sentiment to the ring as well as lowers costs to yours truly, so I'm on board with it.

A reader writes us with a looooong question, but it's worth reading. This guy's in a bad spot. So we tackle it in two ways: 1) We give our advice; and 2) We get the advice from the "other side" -- from our friends at OneWed.

The question:

"It all started when she asked me "what if I don't like the ring you proposed with? Would you be offended if I don't like it?"

"The answer was tricky but I said "yes, I would be offended on the grounds of you missing the point that it is not about the ring, it is about me offering my life to you" Call me old fashion but that is how I feel. However, I tend to be a daredevil and I took her window shopping for the ring. The idea behind it was that at least she would get what she wants (size, cut, color, setting, etc) even if I had to sacrifice the surprise. It was explained to her prior to the incursion that we were doing our homework and that we were not going to buy a ring that night.

There are only a few things we stress as really, really, really important, the kind of shit you can't ignore or blow off.

The proposal is one of these things.

A female reader comments on our article The 10 Commandments of Popping the Question:

A reader writes:

My girlfriend and I are going to be getting engaged on an upcoming weekend.

The process has been very open: we picked out the ring together, she knew when I talked to her dad, and she even knows that I'm proposing that weekend.

However, she doesn't know how or exactly when I'm proposing that weekend. To further complicate matters, her parents are divorced.

Like you, we're a little skeptical of "contests." (Unless it involves Jerry, George, Elaine, and Kramer storming into a room, slapping down a wad of cash, and screaming, "I'm out!")

When we think "contests" we have grizzly memories of Ed McMahon, the lottery, bingo, and the dregs of reality tv. (Like: "Who Wants to Dance with a Millionaire's Top Chef! Enter now to win!!!")

This one's a little different, and it might merit your attention. And maybe even your participation.

Our friends at OneWed have a contest that hinges around your proposal. Here's the good thing. It's not some random raffle or BS "1 in 7 will win!"  If you submit your story, and if the story is deemed better than the other stories, you win. 

Sure, there's upside. If you propose to the girl on Valentine's Day, you kill two birds with one stone, you stretch your flower budget, and you will never forget the date of your engagement.

It's also true that approximately 35% of women will consider this addooooorrrable. 4% of men will approve, and 0% of your buddies will think it's in good taste.

As for the only constituency that truly matters, your girlfriend? Tougher call. It's not that she will hate the proposal. Maybe she's a Hallmark Girl and she'll think it's sweeter than cotton candy dipped in honey, topped with chocolate sprinkles.

Yet there are risks. Such as... For many people, cotton candy dipped in honey, topped with chocolate sprinkles will taste like ass.

Out of 1,095 grooms who responded to the Plunge Poll, 45% said they would go "Ring Shopping" together.

Maybe the results shouldn't shock anyone. Buying a ring is one of the most awkward purchases a guy will ever make, right up there with his first pack of condoms, first over-the-counter Playboy, and first bottle of Pepto.

Take all that awkwardness and roll it into one, and then multiply it by a cost of $5,000, and THEN realize that the recipient will wear it every day for the rest of her life, and (or so you fear) she might judge your character by the size or style of the rock.  No pressure.

It's expensive, scary, intimidating, and it feels like you have a 78% chance of botching the job. So it's no surprise, then, that more and more couples are going ring shopping as a couple, ensuring that the girl will get the ring she wants, even at the expense of ruining that Oh-My-God-Is-That-A-Ring-Oh-Shit-For-Real?-Yes-Yes-Yes-A-Thousand-Times-Yes moment. 

Reader Jon L comments in our proposal article:

"Let me start out by saying that plucking a proposal from any website is just not a good idea. This website is great because they give you general ideas. For some reason, it seems to be the case that quite a few men have to rack their brains to be romantic.

"Men are OFTEN accused of being very simple (emotionally) but let's spin the table here and just look at a few facts that I have noticed in my 23 years on this planet (mind you, I am a social psychologist). Observation 1- Every action that you (as the male in the relationship) make, will have a reaction. The size or power of the reaction depends on you. If you have been with someone long enough to know that you want to marry them... you should know what things gross her out and what things make her say "awwwwWWW". Everyone is different. She may not say "awwwwWWW" but she is thinking it and you should be able to pick that up by a look or some kind of body language. Simply said- watch some chick flicks.

Another groom doesn't read The Plunge, another fiancée gets hurt.

We offer plenty of rules on proposals, but generally, as a good starting point, you should try and avoid an activity that could cause your girlfriend to, you know, die. So we look at snorkeling, sky-diving, and lion-taming proposals with just a touch of skepticism.

Over the weekend, after a romantic hike proposal, the bride literally fell off a cliff, leading to a helicopter rescue. (According to WWMT.com, she's fine.)

From WWMT.com:

We knew that proposing to a woman is scary shit. But we didn't know it was this terrifying.

According to a new British survey, men found proposing to their girlfriends only slightly less terrifying than swimming with sharks, which, you know, has a 95% probability of DEATH.

From Ananova.com:

Four out of five men were so petrified of proposing that they preferred to forego tradition and wait for their girlfriends to propose to them.

Of those polled, over a quarter (28%) ranked swimming with sharks as the scariest thing to do, closely followed by 23% who considered proposing marriage to be the most frightening.

Popping the question ranked more terrifying than jumping out of a plane, going for a job interview and wearing an opposition football shirt in the home stand.

Now, take this survey with a full shaker of salt. It was conducted by a British cinema to promote the premiere of--wait for it--The Proposal. (Sigh.)  So the results could be a little tainted, but still.

To allay your fears, check out The Plunge's Proposal Ideas That Don't Suck and 10 Commandments for Popping the Question.

Score another blow for Tradition.

In a new Plunge poll, almost 70% of guys said that they had asked (or planned to ask) her parents' permission.

69% checked off the response: "Yep. Tradition matters," while the rest of the guys selected, "Screw that. What century are we in?"

For most guys it's not an easy call. And things have changed, making it more difficult than ever to know what to do. Back in the good old days when men were men and the bride couldn't vote, you would ask for her father's "permission" as if haggling over cattle.

We've changed. We've evolved. Western Civilization has surged forward: equal pay, women's suffrage, the polio vaccine, mobile porn on the iPhone.

Asking the father, however, is one of those baffling traditions that just won't die, like the NCAAF bowl system or the Electoral College. But it's tricky: some brides find it chauvinistic and condemn it, some prefer it, some demand it.

To ask or not to ask?

If you want the proposal to be a surprise, obviously, you can't seek her input. So you'll need to take your cues from the bride's background. Where's she from? Is her family traditional or progressive? Rednecks or hippies? For two cartoonish extremes, you can use this handy cheat-sheet:

Get the full breakdown at the full article: Asking Her Old Man: Obligatory Or Offensive?

Four days. Your girlfriend has been looking forward to four days--and, arguably, maybe a few more--her entire life: 1) her wedding; 2) becoming a mother; 3) an event that already happened with some other dude in high school or college; and 4) the engagement proposal. Let's focus on #4. The proposal matters. And you know this. In fact, you're probably over-thinking it, sweating it, getting paranoid.

If you're like most guys, you're having some version of the following inner-monologue: "Okay, this proposal thing needs to be romantic, but I don't wanna be some damn cheeseball. Should I do it in public? Yeah. Yeah. That'll make it memorable. Wait, but then I'll be the mope on one knee in a restaurant asking her to marry me, and what if she says no? And what about the engagement ring, should I hide the son of a bitch?  And what are the 49ers going to do with their first-round draft pick? The O-Line could use a little--[etc, etc, mind wandering, interest in subject exhausted]."  

Your first move: read The Plunge's 10 Commandments of Popping the Question. That's our overall advice for how to think about the marriage proposal, how to scheme, how to not screw it up. But maybe you need some actual, concrete guidelines. We've rounded up the most common, cool proposal ideas (and the uncool) and given you the Pros and Cons. Good luck.

The Family Gathering Proposal
If she likes: Awkward public moments.
Pros: Very few. If her parents already love you, perhaps they'll love you even more. And you won't have to spend two hours serially calling all of her relatives and repeating how-you-proposed stories and announcing your engagement--they're all there. Whhooo.
Cons: Don't do this. Ever. It puts crushing pressure on her, it's awkward for the family, and it robs the moment of all its privacy and dignity. Plus, proposing in front of the family is what the bad guy does in romantic comedies--Bradley Cooper in Wedding Crashers, Cal from Titanic, and the Soul Glo guy from Coming to America. Don't be that guy.

Airplane Letters in the Sky
If she likes: Attention, avionics
Pros: Can be dramatic. Creates the sense that this is NEWS, something that everyone within a 3-mile radius must know about, and must know about now.  Also, if you're truly daring and want to risk some pinpoint timing, you can combine this with any other  proposal idea and use it as the punch line for when you're ready to ask the question, "will you marry me.".
Cons: There's risk. Do you know precisely when this will happen? Are you absolutely convinced you can get her outdoors at the right place at the right time in the right weather...and that the pilot spells the right name?

The Sporting Event
If she likes: Attention from 16,000 strangers.
Pros: This one's tricky. Remember that the marriage proposal is about her, not you. So if you're a die-hard Orioles fan and think it would be badass to propose to her at a game, well, don't. Only do it if she's the die-hard Orioles fan, and even then, only do it if she's obsessed. And don't do this in a playoff game. That last "playoff game" rule is less about romance and more about male-etiquette. Dude it's the playoffs. Show some respect for your team.
Cons: If the answer's not "Yes," you'll blow $60,000 on therapy over the next 10 years to heal the scars.

Cook Her Dinner
If she likes: Quiet evenings at home more than trendy hotspots
Pros: This works best for guys who never cook. Seriously. It'll mean that much more to her. And frankly, cooking a meal isn't really that damn hard. You just find a recipe and follow the bastard. Bonus: sometime in advance, get her to confess her absolute favorite dinner ever-including details on side dishes, appetizers, and dessert. If you're desperate for information and she's tight-lipped, resort to the old "What would you order for dinner as your last meal in case you get electrocuted?" trick. Recreate this meal faithfully down to every last detail, minus electrocution.
Cons: You need to dress it up (flowers, a cartoonish amount of candles, wear a tie, etc.) otherwise it might be too ho-hum.

Sky-Diving
If she likes: Mountain Dew, the X-Games, saying the word "bitchin'"
Pros: We suppose this could work for the certain kind of woman, but you need to be abundantly certain that she has thought about getting engaged, is ready for it, expects it any day now, and the marriage proposal itself is just a formality. A sudden surprise or shock could lead to her freaking out and forgetting to open the parachute, which might cause the not-ideal downside of...
Cons: Death.

Read the entire list of proposal ideas--including the romantic restaurant, the scavenger hunt, the walk on the beach, and our favorite (the vacation)--in the full article here.

You have questions.

We have answers. Today in a value-sized, 3-for-1 special, we cover unconventional honeymoon destinations (Washington DC: yay or nay?), the virtues of linen, and how to get an engagement ring when you're broke.

A reader writes:

We're big believers in one central idea: "If you have a problem, let others try and solve it." So we introduced The Plunge Forums, trusting the wisdom of crowds, the power of shared knowledge, and the efficiency of the open market. After all, if the last couple of years have shown us anything, it's that an unregulated, open market can never go wrong.

But then we launched the site...and guys seemed completely uninterested in using the forums. And you know what? We couldn't blame them.

I mean...how do you tell your buddy with a straight face, "Hey man. Toss me a beer? Thanks. Sorry I'm late. I was busy online, posting a comment in my wedding forums."

Jesus. I feel dirty just typing the words "wedding forums." Damnit. Okay that's the last time those two words will ever, ever be used on this site. Promise.  [Taking a cold shower.]